It is funny how in world is this related to Uta in any way in here?Cosidering this got in topics related to him in here.
Anyway onto the question, my own answer, hope not! Too predictable, too boring and honestly she is kinda forced too much as Kaneki's love interest in here. So yeah, would prefer if they did not hook up and honestly considering whole manga-case, I doubt Ken will hook up with anything if it ends the way I suspect it will.
Ishida definitely is trying to push onto the readers the mindset that Kaneki and Touka will possibly be together. I would be ok with them being together. I think it'd be cute, albeit a little predictable/forced. There isn't really another girl character who could end up with Kaneki. If he ends up with a girl in the first place. He doesn't seem very interested in love or romance.
Well it would in a sense, if it is done correctly. If the romance had some "real" life issues and drama, then it would add maturity. But Kaneki doesn't really seem like he'd want romance though. He values all of his friends and wants to protect them. If he started to value one more than the others, it would be a little hypocritical of his morals. But he totally could. He is a little unpredictable.
I think they will hook up. There are a lot of picture with touka and ken together and been drew by the author so maybe the author want to hint us something, i don't know but i still think they will be couple in the end
Well dont you think romance is the power of romance is a little bit overrated for a seinen, ErnstJung. Also what abt the power of friendship it if its believeable? The only clear "power of friendship" motive you could bring up in TG would be Kanekis reasolve coming from his hallucination with hide and were talking abt a decade friendship where both are highly dependent of each other. So of course such a bond has an immense power over kaneki its pretty much the only one that can conter his bad relatioship with his own mother. its not a fast written platonical bond that enables kaneki to do everything, but sth which impacted the better half of his whole life and still does even after they were parted.
I also dont see how romance is supposed to add maturity to a story, romance itself is a fragile and overrated concept in society most of the time - mostly bc falling in love etc is mostly based on chemical reactions in your body for the simple reason of reproduction and therefore not lasting a lifetime. Even 12-14 year olds can fall in love - does that make them mature? Mostly romantic feelings make you act even ridiculous and unreasonable. So rly at this point for kaneki to fall in love would rather be contraproductive if hes supposed to inherit a participating role in a revolution.
Yeah, Hide is Kaneki's best friend and he is one of the few ones that kaneki really needs. "Even if i personally think that Hide is the most plain character of Tokyo Ghoul.*
Falling love, it's like if i was back to middle school. When we are adult, we speak about affinities and dynamic, we understand that romance is not a sky jump but a little link already existing, that, we may or not decide it if we let it grow or not, specially if you are introspectively/extrospectively smart. It's easier to communicate that way. Limits are created by the mind, instinctively. So if you are personally not able to be in a romance while getting things done, then think that it's not the same for everyone.
IQ/EQ is not determined by age groups. It's an individuation matter. Love is a mental reaction of the psyche. Testosterone/pheromones are chemical "sexual" reactions made by the brain, to the body. Love is born from a lack of comfort, "What Kaneki lacks too.* The fullfilling of love is mean to be understood, to understand thyself in a better way, to trust entirely. Obsession, passion, connection, weakening. Because the Ego is a facade, and the ID is what matters, that's why love is so important in somebody's life, without it people are empty with a feeling of being alone. Never to be understood, only if you have tried to be yourself once in your life instead of running away from your inner self.
Love is much more complicated than i think i love him hihihihi by most young teenagers nowadays.
Life is a huge bag of unreasonable thoughts. The ego is toxic, and there can't be more toxic to someone than his own ego. Not even love, not even hatred.
When i said it would add maturity, i meant realism. Everyone lived different things and so have different opinions on things like love or politics, if you think that love is immature which is a total generalization, then this opinion has been brought by your past experiences, which your ego surely consider as an omniscience being, and nothing exist beyond that.
What is stupid is not the feelings, but the acts commited by people, which has to be said, acts reflect their do'er, and their actual psyche.
A fail to see the necessity for romantical love tho.
Love and comfort is sth you can gain from a platonic relationship just as well - your family, friends etc.
Also if you say "romantic love adds realism" to the story sounds for me the same as "the story lacks realism without a romance" wich is first of all BS second the story does have romantic relationships (nishikimi, yooshimura and ukina)
However coming back to "love" and kaneki lacking love thats something a family/ his friends CAN provide he doesnt need to be in a romantic relationship to love or be loved in a fufilling way just like eto didnt turn out this way bc she didnt have a romantic relationship but bc (amongst other reasons) there was a lack of love in her childhood/ it was overshadowed by violence and in that sense Kaneki and Eto are actually similar. the only thing that kaneki had ahead of her was his relationship with hide and later the friends he made at anteiku. Kaneki was loved in his early childhood but not in a healthy way. They both didnt rly learn how to love and be loved.
Referring to the quote from the start (i think it was from the setting sun) "ppl are born for love and revolution" i also dont see it rly necessary plotwise bc touka and kaneki could just be together without problems - bc the main conflict is between humans and ghouls and that their are not allowed to live together by the system enforced by v/washuus even if they wanted to.
for example a relationship like nishikis and kimis - a ghoul and a human - which endangers both of them would be plot relevant as it has revolutional potential (like ukina and kuzen i mean look at that it created eto one of the major players)
i dont want to say touken is not going to happen bc it probably will since ishida seems to be aiming for the heteronormative ending - its just irrelevant for the plot and not a necessary focus point.
^ "Romantic love ADDS to the realism" vs "the story LACKS realism without a romance".
Correct & Incorrect.
First of all the emphasis on 'adds' and on 'lacks' in both sentences have a completely different weight. 'Adds' points at a small addition of realism brought to story by making romance surface a bit more in the story. While 'lacks' in this case implies the bottom of the barrel. No romance --> no realistic story basically, that's how it's interpreted and that's where the similarity off both sentences stops. But initially that doesn't have to be the case. But this shows that you can't rely on a negative equivalent of the original, more positively implied sentence, because it gets an interpretation that is completely blown out of proportion.
Incorrect because not every story lacks realism when romance isn't involved, but in TG's case i'm positive that it would do some good and add to the vibrant nature the story once showed. Doesn't mean it needs to be generalised to every story will become more realistic when it has more romance in it. Some genres or specific stories don't particularly need it.
The reasons why it would be good to have a bit more romance, is to rid Kaneki of that baby/kid-aura he still has. Just glancing over comments in Kaneki's or Hide's page confirms how people see him as the overpowered ghoulized babyfaced kid that's going to solve an important problem in the end. Romance for example could be a good method to indirectly show us how Kaneki is maturing by taking on responsibility, not running away and grabbing onto to the people dear to him, instead of keeping them safe from a distance. It would mean he overcame a drastic obstacle within himself. The one where he doesn't allow himself some happyness.
You are confounding comfort and support here. There are things that love gives that friendship will never be able to give. Actually, EtoKen is my second favourite ship after ShuuNeki I'll quote a fellow retard from Reddit "Gourmet X Kaneki. There is nothing I want more than for either Noro or the Gourmet to end up on top, now I say Gourmet x Kaneki what I really mean is the Gourmet devouring Kaneki. The guy has clear goals unlike almost every other character." You gradually learn how to love or be loved while living, love is like a talent that is here and that need to be built correctly. The series lacks of maturity, yes it does,in the relational way, interactions etc etc. The goal for Sui to get done is to improve that part of his writing. Touka was created for the purpose that there would be someone obscene over Kaneki, obsessive, that is waiting for him, that believe in him. She is the one waiting for him, the one supposedly waiting at home. To start the story. It is more than hinted that while both were working on the coffee shop they start to fall for each other, in an individualistic way. In the first part, their loves were different from one to the other, Touka was immature, and so Kaneki became, in the end of the aogiri, arc, more mature. Hence he told her that he doesn't want her to join him, and etc etc. Mostly everything had a romantic purpose behind it. Touka plays the romantic role, Hide plays the best friend role, Shuu, him, has a. Cook role? jk
You speak like romantic love is needed to pass as an adult thats the most unrealistic statement for me here. Also Kaneki has had a romantic love interest and that is Rize. Idk if youve read the first chapter ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ He had a crush on her, she thought of him as interesting, they share similar interests the only problem was that she (similar to shuu) wanted to eat him. but as a love interest she definitly has more potential from the set up. oh and since were at it: did he seem any more mature to you when he was obv very interested in havin a relationship with rize?
When Touka told him he has no place to belong to being neither ghoul nor human kaneki was able to cheer up bc he had hide as "His place to belong to" (home so to speak) which was never corrected to touka or anteiku being it, maybe his ccg family in his haise persona. so touka being the person "waiting for him at home" doesnt rly make sense either.
what im saying is theres just a poor set up for touka even though shes going to be it - thats why i cant see her future - romantic relationship with kaneki as sth crucial for his developement or the plot rather sth that will be shown in the epilog or implied. the big turning points of his were his hallucinations with rize, chibishiro and hide (which are also the ppl he opened up to in his hallucinations - for rize talking abt his mother, chibishiro admitting how cruel his mother was and for hide stating how lonely he is without him additionally in the chapter afterwards he was honest to himself and to arima which is sth).
id like to add that these last mentioned are all made up in his mind meaning these are all things hes telling himself. which means he encouraged himself to live and search for sth worth living for
-sth that makes him feeling happy and fufilled - which has been discussed a few chapters beforehead with yomos story whos living for serving coffee and seeing hikaris children grow up *gasp* no love interest DOES THAT MEAN YOMO IS NOT MATURE??? THAT A ROMANCE IS NEEDED TO MNAKE HIM FINALLY A MAN ???¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- so practically he already has overcome the obstacle that is himself and at the end of the day what bigger obstacle is there honstly. so no need for a romance as a plot enforcing point still.
im telling you a secret then : yomo loves someone: touka and ayato ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ you can love someone to pieces, more than yourself, completly selflessly, unconditionally and LOTS OF THINGS THAT CAN MAKE YOU MATURE WITHOUT ROMANTIC FEELINGS!!
but i see i cant discuss with u bc you seem to believe ppl who arent in a romantic relationships are invalid as a mature person. so yeah. thats ... thats actually pretty funny.
and for hide? did you not read the anteiku raid? hes on a cliffhanger - of course hes not shown - but hes the last person kaneki met before his final fight and the last conversation before a big battle is sth important.
I never said that i thought that people who weren't in a relationship weren't mature, i said that friendship is overrated and that you must be a hermit to believe that friendship is or can be something of really deep, deeper than love. No, friendship is not meant for that at the first. Friendship is mean to support, but real friendship will never be as much strong as real love. Romance doesn't mean someone grow, but it makes an individual a lot more responsible, like Dayne mentioned before. Love can change someone's vision, perception, it can bring hope to someone, which a simple friendship cannot accomplish. Kaneki wouldn't even come to there if it weren't for Touka giving him huge punches on his faces as a gift. Her impulse made him realize that what he was doing was stupid. Hide plays a support role, but never the trigger role Touka played.
Omg youre one of those ppl who supports toukas physical abuse of kaneki ahahaha. i have no further question here. Yeah touka love him and hes in love with her for lots she just punches him like his dear mother - true love romance right here and there ♥♥
And yeah you can absolutly love your friends/family thats love too which nothing less worth than romantic love. Ever heard of platonical love - soulmates? Bc srsly the concept of romance is nothing less a fantastic concept then that of soulmates.
And hides not a trigger? Im ... have you read Tokyo Ghoul? bc id recommend you to do it i know its a lot but you know hide appears there and you should read that if youre abt to talk abt his role - its kind of relevant for analyzing hides role =/
"Love can change someone's vision, perception, it can bring hope to someone, which a simple friendship cannot accomplish" ... ... *sighs* *looks the last third of chapter 75* *even bigger sigh*
Instead of romance what do you think of 'intimacy', some more relationship-building, instead of friends confronting each other and beating acquaintances into a pulp (or trying)...
I personally am just waiting for some more interactions that show personal growth in characters, have they adjusted their mindset or are they still spouting the same nonsense.
I'm not particularly aiming for a TouKen confession here, just more interaction on a more intimate level & with intimate I'm neither implying it has to be physical only. Can be mentally syncing their feelings or thoughts as well. I'd rather not have Ishida leaving these relationships as they are, an unbreakable trust & bond forged by a few months working together in a café and helping each other out from time to time when things get harsh & difficult. That doesn't really seem like the standard relationship most people form when doing a part-time job and helping out their co-worker when he/she has some troubles, which ends in a bond that isn't affected by time or distance...
And Furuta you're blowing that steam out again in topics you shouldn't be so steamy about. Cool down, nobody is out to skin Hide alive and take his title of 'Kaneki's best male buddy' from him or advertise for more feministic abuse to submit males. What do you take us for... bullies? Only thing that happens is sharing that Hide's omnipotential influence on Kaneki might not be the only 'cure of eternal lifesuffering' Kaneki has. Adjusting that Hidemania to a bit more realistic proportions. Fact remains that this walking cure can't do shit, if he doesn't interact with Kaneki, so it's only natural people will start looking for possible characters who can partially substitute for Hide's absence.
which one represents hope for you? hmm ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ you are right of course thinking abt hide did him nothing good - touka is his true love - never her of the true loves punch? that can only touka can give him ♥
wait you are implying not be the only cure for kaneki? BUT DAYINE I THOUGHT ONLY TOUKA CHWAN CAN MAKE HIM A REAL MAN BY MATURE ROMANCE IM SO CONFUSED NOW =0000
This is getting out of hand, off handed remarks, sarcasm, not respecting the opinions of others, and only giving debatable evidence to justify yourself, mostly about a character that has nothing to do with this thread, is not the way to have a discussion. Dominating an argument doesn't mean throwing comebacks against threats that aren't even there. I'd like to join this conversation but, this is getting thrown out of proportion and quite frankly, a real turn off. Last I checked this is a wiki, not a sanctuary to lose your cool.
Nah, no need to close the thread over one trouble-maker. Everyone else has been behaving themselves.
@Furutasmole, tone it down. There is absolutely no need to come into this thread with such a combative attitude, attacking others like this. You've been warned about your attitude before, and if this continues you will be removed from this thread.
^^Why do you feel like people are talking to you all the time?
I was talking to the people saying they want this discussion back on track, to ultimately end it in the "Tragedy x Everyone is OTP"-punchline. It practically implies the topic is over and done with, if someone needs to use that punchline to ease the mood.
And I found this a ridiculous way to end, because OTP's weren't exactly the point of discussion here.
I should leave it alone, it's not that I have much interest in pursuing this into other obstinate thoughtpatterns at this point.
i think if kaneki opens up to touka after he comes back it could possibly happen, as it would be some great development for both the characters. They have both lost a lot but can make each others lives easier once they have a proper talk......So lets get to that talk.
Honestly I don't think Kaneki will end up with anyone. He just doesn't seem interested in any romance currently. I think TouKen is cute but it just doesn't seem like a close relationship. The ship rides on the nostalgia as they've only been together for 3-4 months in TG and haven't seen each other for 3 years in Re. Not to mention, Kaneki is extremely closed off and what little Touka knows about him is from Hide. I also don't like her hitting him but its understandable since, well...shes Touka and thats a part of her character. I wonder how their talk will go.
Then how about his issue with depression and his insecurities? Don't forget her fear of abandonment and making mistakes. Sure, they share the same loneliness, but a combination of the rest of their issues? That relationship would go possibly no where for years.
We will see WEEABXTVH.I am sure Kaneki and Touka can resolve it next chapter. The insecurity and depression of them have been going for years. I am sure they can relate their insecurity and depression and resolve it.
Their talk will probably about this or something like this I could be wrong. Will see.
Exactly though Touka will be the one who wants serious relationship.Kaneki doesn t seems to be the type especially now.Kaneki have shown little to romantic interest to anyone.beside at the beggining of Tokyo ghoul original which was just crush on Rize.
Srsly I think it's not a good idea to bring 'romance' now into Tg. Like, k, I don't care at all if they come up together or not. But aren't things kinda... out of control atm? And if Ishida only bring them together to make Toukas or Kanekis Dead even more 'tragic' I'm gonna be a little bit mad. Besides that im totally not into this whole shipping thing and I absolutly don't care at all who is gonna end up with who but... I feel like they don't fit together at all.
I mean in the actuall situation. Ofc it fits in this series. But now with all the... you know things going around
Pls don't understand me wrong or get triggered or sth.. But like.. Kaneki is the Leader of the one organisation that Want to bring balance. And for now, there is so much balance in tokyo like my balance in my sleep shedule
But on the other hand.. love comes in our darkest time~~ K
There are some truth In what you say @Pancake.But I think Romance between Kaneki and Touka could happen still. Considering Ishida have been foreshadowing since beggining and up until now. This just what I think personally.
I don t think romance could happen now. As Kaneki still havent achieve his goal of uniting Humans and Ghouls just yet.there Is hugh possibility of It happening around after the ending. It can also happen next chapter.
Only Ishida knows.I am just theories considering Foreshadowing and Hints of it happening.
Yeah no chapter this week.. Sunako I don't really think that these "mental illness" or lets say these "mental disorders" can just be overcome like nothing ever happend. I don't even know if there is a cure for something like this. But that's just my personal opinion. I'm not a doctor.
I see well the only way to overcome Mental illness or mental disorder Is by going to therapy. You can t heal by Medicine sadly. So Kaneki can overcome His mental Issues and disorder on his own. but It takes times.
Though with the help of threrapy and Support,Kaneki can overcome his mental Issues.
Kaneki is One eye ghoul and Touka is ghoul. The result would be unknown at this point. The child could be half human or Natural one eye ghoul as far what the child would becom3. I don think the baby would just die or won t happen. Those are two options I think.
even if he counted as a hybrid those are very likely infertile not to talk abt how his kakuhou must have messed up his dna then bc its female while he is male but hey maybe touka could impregnate kaneki with her kagune then :'D
yes bc they have human mothers. human bodies dont think ghoulbabies are food.
youre just pushing to want a baby in the mix when there is storywise no ground for a baby right now. if anything you gotta wait for an epiloge or sth. but again i wouldnt get my hopes up if i was you bc currently mores speaking against a baby inverse biology as well as plotwise and charactervdevelopementwise.
Pancake - i agree with your points entirely unfortunatly not many ppl put much thought into it they just want them to do the nasty and push a child of them for some kind of naruto/bleach/harry potter ending and dont consider toukas or kanekis actual mindset if they are even on the same level on of their relationship, even if a crush is mutual it doesnt have to lead to a marriage or even a relationship there are so many things to consider beforehead and actually its not far fetched to actually consider them considering the type of manga we are reading here. This is not a shoujo.
I personally have a hard time imagening kaneki actually wanting a child anytime soon or even being ready for sex especially given the current context, considering how messed up his childhood was, also "accidental pregnancy" is a pretty soap opera trope which doesnt really fit tg in my opnion.
And yeah any fetus wouldnt have high hopes in any sense. I'm glad to see a person being critical about it :)
I don't even know if Kaneki has some really romantic "interest" in Touka. Yeah maybe deep down he has, but u know there are so many things in his head going on and.. Maybe this is not accurate for every person on this planet but I think you can only "truly" love another if u are in love with yourself (sounds egdy I know). And Kaneki doesn't seem like he's loving (=accepting) himself atm. So how could he be ready for any "serious" realitionship at the moment mentally? Mentally not physically.
Kaneki does have romantic feelings for Touka. It was Implied two or three chapters ago. The only reason Kaneki is going to reject her.Is because he is suicidal and I am not worthy kind of attitude towards himself.
Without that,I don t see any other reason for Kaneki to reject her. Though next chapter we will see Kaneki decision. Will he accept her or reject her. Not going to be the suprise at either outcome. I am hoping for the former decision from Kaneki.
Isn't a child pure business to women... A lot of guys make an appointment for an employment interview. She inspects the goods based on a list of necessary requirements & the guy that posesses the most of those requirements, will be accepted. He'll become an official part of the family business.
Now with that said, let's hope Touka & Kaneki leave it (for now) to rolling in grassy fields under an open sky, while enjoying each others company.
I do think Pancake hits it close to the mark with his "love yourself". You can't turn your love outwards, if there's no love within. You first got to fill that bucket, before it can overflow to the people around you.
And again Sunako you totally don't get what im saying. I said that deep down he may have feelings for Touka. But his current mindset is kinda screwed up. So yeah.
And besides that wouldn't it be better for Kaneki if (after this whole birdgace V thing is over) he would spend time for himself and figure out what he wants to do with his life before he starts a relationship that could end well but bad aswell.
I do get what you are saying @Pancake. like I said Kaneki will make his decision next chapter. I do agree with what you are saying about Kaneki current mindset. Time will tell then there not much to be said at this point. Just wait and see Kaneki mindset unpredictable at this point.
@Dayne It was two chapters ago When Touka mention the way Kaneki look at when he was as Haise the same he look at Rize.
I think I rest my part about this. Only next chapter can tell.
But Sunako... It was Haise Sasaki who looked the way to Touka. He literally was in denial (or amnesia dunno) about Kaneki at this moment. He even said afterwards "I was such an idiot". And we can asume that Haise looked that way to Touka where he was not totally aware of his second personality. Or his third, or his fourth or his.. I think you know what I mean. And we know, he "experienced" Kaneki in himself the more :re was running.
Okay I respond to this one at least since you are asking. Kaneki and Haise be different In personality.They are still the same person with same inner thoughts and Desires.
Kameki said he is idiot.Because Haise is more open of his feelings than Kaneki and blew It when he keep visiting and looking at Touka. Simple Haise was more open of his feelings and Kaneki is more close up.
Different personality but with same thoughts and Inner desires.
Ishida will eventually show us If Kaneki have romantic feelings for Touka or not. There nothing else to be said at this point.
I mean actually and ppl gonna be pissy at me again for bringing this up but theres an extremly dominating desire/factor which seperated sasaki from kaneki and that is meeting/missing/being with hide.
so no they arent the same person/having the same desires bc hide being like the most polarizing factor for kanekis personality/developement was practically nonexistent in haises life. and that also influents kanekis decisions, desires, relationships etc distinctively from haises.
so while haise MAY have approached touka somewhere down along the line it doesnt necessarily apply to kaneki bc his priorities differ.
The most hilarious thing of all, Pancake, is that there is a high chance that the outcome will satisfy everyone here. Everyone that so vigorously defended his own opinion against the other. And the best thing of all is that we'll keep bickering even after outcome, to try and determine who's faith & speculation for the outcome was the most correct, regardless off everyone's satisfaction. :)
Which then nicely proves how we're all retards and not so different from each other after all.
That's what a community is all about. There's a point where everyone needs the realize the other person will fill in the gaps however he/she wants it or finds it the most logical. Big grouphug for the big happenings that do align in everyone's view.
Same for hidekane for me *shrugs* also like touka finding a new place to live at peacefully, kaneki coping with his issues in a healthy way, more touka and hinami bonding, happyness for seidou and hide, thats what actually counts.